Blackfoot sub. template problems Options

[highdesertdave2]

Last night I created a act. with AG4 on this template. The AG4 seem to work fine but when I tried to run the act. in the Sim. It starting doing some weird things.

First as it was loading the sim said it couldn't place a certain tank car on the track. I changed the tank car for another and the act. started right up.

Next it started with the right number of cars and the first pickup matched the work order but at the next town on the work order it said I was to pick up five box cars well when I got to the town there was no box cars to be found, no freight cars at all.

The next town looked right but by then I had to call it a night. I did a save after each town so I had several.

When I tried to load any of the saves today they all failed to load the Sim. kept saying it couldn't load different shapes.

Anybody know what going on here? If I start it from the begining it works fine. Dave

[nbeveridge]

Last night I created a act. with AG4 on this template. The AG4 seem to work fine but when I tried to run the act. in the Sim. It starting doing some weird things.

First as it was loading the sim said it couldn't place a certain tank car on the track. I changed the tank car for another and the act. started right up.

Next it started with the right number of cars and the first pickup matched the work order but at the next town on the work order it said I was to pick up five box cars well when I got to the town there was no box cars to be found, no freight cars at all.

The next town looked right but by then I had to call it a night. I did a save after each town so I had several.

When I tried to load any of the saves today they all failed to load the Sim. kept saying it couldn't load different shapes.

Anybody know what going on here? If I start it from the begining it works fine. Dave

Usually the car placement error occurs because too many cars are being added in a particular place such that the last car(s) is placed over the end of the track (on a stub end track), which thus starts in derailment, or in collision with another car (if the track is double ended), which also starts in derailment. As you can imagine, MSTS will not start with a railcar in derailment, and thus the error message that it cannot place the car. This can happen if too many long cars are selected by AG for the siding length, or if the template builder did not place the starting point of the car string at the very beginning of the track. Sometimes MSTS will go ahead and start the activity in spite of this error, but will not place the car(s).

Were you using the maximum car fill? If you get this kind of error, try generating a new activity with fewer cars in the world car fill option. If the error persists, then we will want to trouble shoot the template.

I have found that any time I can get MSTS to start an activity which had this error to begin with, no saved activity will ever start. Only when the original activity is free of this error will the saved activity have a chance of starting.

As for the missing cars in the town, did you also get a placement error on the box cars? Sometimes one error masks another, and replacement of the tank car may have allowed continuation of the activity even though the box cars were also in error. The only time I have "seen" missing cars like this was when those cars had a placement error -- apparently MSTS will not place the entire string in some cases, if the last car(s) is in collision.

Generally, if I get an error like this I do not try to fix the specific activity, but instead try to figure out why the error occurred, fix the problem in the activity generation options or in the template itself, and then generate a new activity. Only when the activity is error free will I go ahead with it.

[highdesertdave2]

Usually the car placement error occurs because too many cars are being added in a particular place such that the last car(s) is placed over the end of the track (on a stub end track), which thus starts in derailment, or in collision with another car (if the track is double ended), which also starts in derailment. As you can imagine, MSTS will not start with a railcar in derailment, and thus the error message that it cannot place the car. This can happen if too many long cars are selected by AG for the siding length, or if the template builder did not place the starting point of the car string at the very beginning of the track. Sometimes MSTS will go ahead and start the activity in spite of this error, but will not place the car(s).

Were you using the maximum car fill? If you get this kind of error, try generating a new activity with fewer cars in the world car fill option. If the error persists, then we will want to trouble shoot the template.

I have found that any time I can get MSTS to start an activity which had this error to begin with, no saved activity will ever start. Only when the original activity is free of this error will the saved activity have a chance of starting.

As for the missing cars in the town, did you also get a placement error on the box cars? Sometimes one error masks another, and replacement of the tank car may have allowed continuation of the activity even though the box cars were also in error. The only time I have "seen" missing cars like this was when those cars had a placement error -- apparently MSTS will not place the entire string in some cases, if the last car(s) is in collision.

Generally, if I get an error like this I do not try to fix the specific activity, but instead try to figure out why the error occurred, fix the problem in the activity generation options or in the template itself, and then generate a new activity. Only when the activity is error free will I go ahead with it.

Hi Norm, I'm still having problems with EB temp. Now when I try to use it, It says it can't place a certain car on the tracks every time.
The WB temp. works ok. But one I made called for two engines to go out to the four oil upgrader tracks and pick up all the cars there and take them to the last town west. The problem was when the engines got to the oil upgrader tracks it was full of all kinds of freight cars not just tank cars I check the TD file and those tracks are marked for tank cars only.
Can you or Steve check this template out?
Btw I don't know how close you are to doing the IC template but you may want to hold off on it for a bit, seems Paul Fowler and Frank Burns are joining the two section together and updating it after all these years. You can check on it yourself over at the Mophouse forum if you like.

[dispatcher]

Hi Norm, I'm still having problems with EB temp. Now when I try to use it, It says it can't place a certain car on the tracks every time.
The WB temp. works ok. But one I made called for two engines to go out to the four oil upgrader tracks and pick up all the cars there and take them to the last town west. The problem was when the engines got to the oil upgrader tracks it was full of all kinds of freight cars not just tank cars I check the TD file and those tracks are marked for tank cars only.
Can you or Steve check this template out?
Btw I don't know how close you are to doing the IC template but you may want to hold off on it for a bit, seems Paul Fowler and Frank Burns are joining the two section together and updating it after all these years. You can check on it yourself over at the Mophouse forum if you like.

As the author of the Blackfoot template, I felt obligated to test the template out for that abnormality. I created 2 or 3 without any problems at all. If you use the oil upgrader as the source tracks, however, you will have that problem of any and all types of cars for pickup from those tracks no matter what the track designation is. I too, in the past, wanted to be able to start at the upgrader tracks making a full train of oil cars to be delivered further West but cannot because of that problem. If you start further East and stop at these tracks, you can pick up oil cars only but I did not wish to start somewhere else.
Perhaps Steve can further address this problem and correct it in future updates or maybe my converting the template to AG4 will help.

Dispatcher

[sgdavis]

As the author of the Blackfoot template, I felt obligated to test the template out for that abnormality. I created 2 or 3 without any problems at all. If you use the oil upgrader as the source tracks, however, you will have that problem of any and all types of cars for pickup from those tracks no matter what the track designation is. I too, in the past, wanted to be able to start at the upgrader tracks making a full train of oil cars to be delivered further West but cannot because of that problem. If you start further East and stop at these tracks, you can pick up oil cars only but I did not wish to start somewhere else.
Perhaps Steve can further address this problem and correct it in future updates or maybe my converting the template to AG4 will help.

Dispatcher

It is something specific to do with this particular template. Perhaps the .act file and SWLACT csv file are not in sync -- I have seen that happen before and cause strange freight cars to be placed. Also please note that if you designate a track as a "Source" track (i.e. check it for work in the top-most box in the activity generation screen) then it WILL place any and all types of cars there. That's necessary in order for AG to be able to create activities that involve cars being set out further down the line. To make sure only the type of car that you want is in a track, make that track an "Industry" track (by only calling for work on that track using the middle or second track selection box).

So to get tank cars from a yard, take them to the upgrader and then set them out there with tank cars to pickup at the upgrader, you should use a yard track as the initial "source" track, or, start with cars already in the player train. Then call for work at Oil Upgrader but only by checking the related tracks in the middle box.

I recall discussing this with the template author some time ago but I thought we finally got it sorted out.

Again I'll take a look at this template and try and duplicate this, but I may not be able to get to it until the weekend. Plaese let me know if this advice helps in the mean time.

Thanks,

Steve