Sequential Pickups Problem Options

[sgdavis]

A true yard classification job takes a string of cars (dropped off by an inbound train) that is in random order, and sorts those cars out to destination tracks. The key here is that the source track must be scrambled. I've been wracking my brain, but I cannot find any way of doing that with AG. Any ideas?

I agree that's what a classification job does, but I am confused when you say you can't get this behavior from AG. Take a look at this switchlist, generated with simple mode off:  WORKORDER_MP1_Eastbound.pdf ( 11.68K ) Number of downloads: 107
. You'll see that the cars on the yard tracks are definitely NOT in order of where the cars need to be set out (although SOME are clumped together -- which is also prototypical as often ladings with similar destinations are pre-blocked in trains before they get to the yard). So if you want a job that classifies your own train then delivers to the industries, I would recommend taking a list like this one, and first re-sorting so the cars are in the yard in cuts as needed, then assembling the train so those cars destined for similar destinations are blocked together.

For example using the switchlist here as an example, some cars destined for "South Siding 5" can be found on yard track 1 ("Whitefish Siding 1"), but 1 car destined for that siding is sitting in Yard track 10 (presumably, it came in on a different train?), and a few more are sitting on yard track 11.

Also if you like classification at the end of a run, you can use the "Assemble Train" option for ending the activity -- this will require you to put the train in a specific (random) order before the activity can end.

Finally, another way to accomplish exactly what you want is to use an older template and use Switchlist Generator which comes free with Activity Generator, and turn off Simple Mode in that program. That program works differently -- all cars are pre-placed on the various tracks. Then which cars to pickup are selected randomly.

Thanks,

Steve

Attached File(s)

 WORKORDER_MP1_Eastbound.txt ( 13.67K ) Number of downloads: 95

 

[tjbuege]

I'm sorry, but your sample work order makes my point. If you look at any given source track (Whitefish Siding 1, Whitefish Siding 10 or Whitefish Siding 11) all the cars within any given track are clumped together by destination. I want to generate a classification job where a single track is switched out to multiple destination yard tracks, with the source track and all the destination tracks in the same yard. When I do this, I end up with all the cars for a destination track clumped together on the source track, instead of randomly placed in that source track. I don't want my cars to be randomly pulled from various source tracks, I want them pulled from random positions withing a single source track. Also, I'm not looking to have this generated job also run out on the mainline. It will only classifiy cars. In a large enough yard, this could take a while.

If there are certain settings that can achieve this, please enlighten me. I haven't been able to figure it out yet.

I'd be interested in trying an old style template with Switchlist Generator. Where is that documented?

Thanks,
Tim

[sgdavis]

I'm sorry, but your sample work order makes my point. If you look at any given source track (Whitefish Siding 1, Whitefish Siding 10 or Whitefish Siding 11) all the cars within any given track are clumped together by destination. I want to generate a classification job where a single track is switched out to multiple destination yard tracks, with the source track and all the destination tracks in the same yard. When I do this, I end up with all the cars for a destination track clumped together on the source track, instead of randomly placed in that source track. I don't want my cars to be randomly pulled from various source tracks, I want them pulled from random positions withing a single source track. Also, I'm not looking to have this generated job also run out on the mainline. It will only classifiy cars. In a large enough yard, this could take a while.

If there are certain settings that can achieve this, please enlighten me. I haven't been able to figure it out yet.

I'd be interested in trying an old style template with Switchlist Generator. Where is that documented?

Thanks,
Tim

I see, sorry I misunderstood. I don't think there is any way to accomplish exactly what you're requesting in the current version of Activity Generator. The closest thing to it would be to set up one track in the yard (with your string of cars) as an "Industry" track, and several others as "destination" tracks. Although I think what will happen when you do that is, you will get random pickups to be sure, maybe cars 2, 4, 7, 11, 19, 23 etc., but all those may go to the same destination tracks, and, the rest will just sit there. What you are looking for is something that will require every car in a string to be assigned a destination, and that destination to be chosen randomly. I think it can be done but I'll need to give it some real thought. It might mean creating yet another type of track, 'C' for "Classification", that will exhibit this sort of behavior. Or use a check box of some sort so that the user's "source" tracks are treated as this "Classification" type of track.

I'll start to investigate how difficult it will be to modify Activity Generator to also more fully randomize cars in the yard. Although this probably seems like a simple matter, it really isn't, because of the way in which Activity Genertor places cars in the yard. Because of the limits MSTS has in the number of cars that can be in the simulated "world", I can't just flood all the yard tracks with cars. So first I put in the cars, one by one, on an as needed basis to satisfy the setouts that the activity is calling for. Then the program adds more cars to make the "world" look more real and full, until it hits the MSTS limits or the limits the user has set to protect frame rates etc. To do what you are saying, I think I'd have to move to a "2-pass" scheduling system: first putting the cars needed on the tracks, then randomizing them in a second pass. I'd have to make sure the car numbers etc. were preserved since they will be in the work order. I think I CAN accomplish it but it will take some thought, it is non-trivial and if not approached carefully could introduce more bugs and problems than the one it solves since it adds almost twice the complexity to the scheduling algorithm.

As far as using SwitchList Generator, I'm not sure it's "documented" anywhere, but on our Templates page, you'll note the last column, "Skyline Program Version Required to Run (AG: Activity Generator, SLG: SwitchList Generator Classic)"
Some templates, like the one for Andre Ming's (payware) A&O Sub, or the freeware Frisco Ft. Smith route (which has some great yards including a big one at Monett) can run with either version, you'll see it states in that column, "SLG Classic OR AG 3 or later." Some ONLY run under SLG Classic. But templates with "SLG Classic" in that last column are what you are looking for, there are quite a few. You have it if you installed Activity Generator. Just go to Start, then All Programs, and in your Activity Master program group, you'll see a program called "Switchlist Generator Classic" or "Switchlist Generator 1.6". Use that program to load any template that can run with SwitchList Generator Classic let me know what you think. It will be a lot more random (cars won't be clumped together by destination) but it may not pick up every car in that "inbound" or "to be classified" track. With SLG Classic set your one yard track as a "source" track and the other tracks in the yard to classify to, as "industry" tracks.

I'm sorry we aren't able to provide exactly what you are looking for at this point. SLG Classic ought to be a good fix in the short term until I can figure this out. On the other hand I think it will be a fun challenge for me to work on!

Thanks,

Steve

[tjbuege]

I'll start to investigate how difficult it will be to modify Activity Generator to also more fully randomize cars in the yard. Although this probably seems like a simple matter, it really isn't, because of the way in which Activity Genertor places cars in the yard.

I was giving this some thought, too. I have noticed before that with some activities, the consists are not in sequential order. For example, in the MLT Cascades Crossing route, a player consist is scrambled. See chilo_player.con. I think all you need to do is swap the ordering of the cars around, making sure to keep everything pertaining to a single car, together. I just tried this manually with a text editor, with one of the activities I generated using AG. When I started up the activity, the car numbers were all out of order, but the activity still ran. I'm pretty good with Perl, and I might tackle a little script that will scramble selected tracks. I'll play around with that and see how it turns out. If I get something to work, I'll send it to you to look at.

As far as using SwitchList Generator, I'm not sure it's "documented" anywhere, but on our Templates page [. . .]

I did notice that. I'll take a look at those templates and try to figure that out, too.

I'm sorry we aren't able to provide exactly what you are looking for at this point. SLG Classic ought to be a good fix in the short term until I can figure this out. On the other hand I think it will be a fun challenge for me to work on!

No problem. I'm just relieved that I finally was able to explain myself.

Thanks!
Tim